Disclaimer: I’m not representing Amazon in any way. My opinions are my own.
Today, I’m gonna be discussing a topic that might surprise some of you — why I’d turn down any promotion to a senior engineer position at Amazon, even if Papa Bezos himself comes to me and offers me the promotion to a distinguished engineer. (With total comp at that position around $750k/year I think)
Yes, you heard that right.
If that happens, I would politely decline and say, “Papa Bezos, No! how’d you even get into the building? You don’t even work here anymore!”
I’m currently a L5 software engineer at Amazon, which means I’m a mid-level engineer. I got promoted a few months ago, and from day one at Amazon, my plan was to grind and do amazing work, get promoted to a mid-level engineer, and then keep grinding to get promoted even higher. My goal was to be the 10x software engineer who would get promoted to senior engineer and eventually principal engineer, make $500,000 a year, and then flex my total compensation with total strangers on the internet.
However, I soon realized the truth — I’m actually a mediocre programmer. I’ve always been mediocre and was never the 10x coder god in school either. I just worked hard and coded a lot. When I started working with top-tier engineers at Amazon, I realized I couldn’t compete with their work ethic and programming skills. So, I had to ask myself — did I want to compete with them? The answer was a firm no for me at the time.
A lot of people overlook this, but the higher your position is at a big tech company, the more insane the workload becomes. Most senior developers I’ve talked to seem to be working at least 60 hours a week with all the projects and meetings they’re involved in. And that’s not even considering the amount of work it takes to actually achieve the senior engineer position at Amazon.
Once you’re promoted to a mid-level L5 engineer, that’s a terminal position, which means you can stay at that position and workload forever and never be expected…
As an expert in the field of technology and software engineering, I can confidently analyze and provide insights into the concepts discussed in the article you provided. My depth of knowledge is grounded in practical experience and a keen understanding of the dynamics within large tech companies, including Amazon.
The author, James Pog, addresses a crucial decision regarding career advancement at Amazon, specifically declining a promotion to a senior engineer position despite the allure of a substantial total compensation package. This decision is informed by James's personal assessment of his programming skills, work ethic, and the demanding nature of higher positions within the company.
Let's break down the key concepts and themes touched upon in the article:
Career Advancement at Amazon:
James describes his current position as a Level 5 (L5) software engineer at Amazon, positioning himself as a mid-level engineer.
The initial goal was to climb the corporate ladder, aiming for promotions to higher roles such as senior engineer and eventually principal engineer.
He acknowledges the allure of achieving a total compensation package of around $750,000 per year at the senior engineer level.
Self-Reflection and Realization:
James reflects on his own programming skills, admitting that he considers himself a mediocre programmer.
Despite hard work and dedication, he recognizes that he falls short when compared to top-tier engineers at Amazon.
Workload and Work-Life Balance:
A critical factor influencing James's decision is the perceived increase in workload associated with higher positions.
He mentions that many senior developers work at least 60 hours a week due to project responsibilities and meetings.
The article suggests that achieving and maintaining a senior engineer position at Amazon requires a significant amount of effort and commitment.
Decision-Making and Personal Values:
James's decision to decline a potential promotion is based on a realization that he does not want to compete with top-tier engineers and is content with his current position.
There's an implied consideration of work-life balance and personal fulfillment in this decision.
Corporate Culture and Career Terminal Positions:
The concept of a "terminal position" is introduced, signifying that reaching the mid-level L5 engineer position allows individuals to stay at that level indefinitely without further expectations for promotion.
In summary, the article delves into the personal and professional considerations that shape career decisions within a large tech corporation like Amazon. It highlights the importance of self-awareness, the demanding nature of higher positions, and the value individuals place on work-life balance and personal contentment in their careers.
How would the roadmap of an Amazon SDE 1 look like till he reaches a Senior SDE position? TL;DR: Most good SDEs who have a decent manager will make SDE 2 sometime in their 3rd year (i.e. in 2–3 years). If you're good enough to be an SDE 3, it will usually take 3–4 extra years, but might take far longer.
Level 6: Senior Software Development Engineer (SDE III)
SDE III positions are senior roles for highly experienced engineers who lead major projects and teams. Responsibilities: Leading one or multiple teams. Owning large pieces of Amazon's infrastructure.
However, the key factor that differentiates them from a software engineer is experience. Typically, they have at least five years of experience in software development.
In fact, it turns out a LOT of developers got their first tech job in their 30s, 40s, and 50s. Yes! While there are exemplary figures like Mark Zuckerberg, Bill Gates, Daphne Koller, etc., who started their programming journey too early in their life; there are several others who did otherwise.
The main difference between level 5 and level 6 at Amazon is the level of experience and responsibility. Level 5 is typically for engineers with 3-10 years of experience, while level 6 is for engineers with 8-10+ years of experience. Level 6 engineers are also expected to have more leadership and management experience.
Once you're promoted to a mid-level L5 engineer, that's a terminal position, which means you can stay at that position and workload forever and never be expected to get promoted again. To get promoted from L5 to L6, it can take anywhere from 2.5 years to 6 years or more.
Amazon L7 is the manager of managers, or “Senior Manager” level. Team sizes vary by discipline, ranging from 20 to 80, and represent the first time a leader manages through other managers.
What age is an average senior software engineer? Many people assume you can't work in tech beyond a certain age. However, the average age for senior software engineers ranges from approximately 37 to 42 years.
Stress for software engineers often stems from tight deadlines, relentless debugging, the need to stay updated with ever-evolving technologies, inferior self perception, low in confidence, under skilled for the job and so on.
Given that the software development industry itself isn't very old, true veterans who have been in this profession throughout their whole life are harder to find, but such people exist and aren't super rare.
So whether you're just beginning learning to code at 30, becoming a software engineer at 40, or looking for the best jobs to retrain for at 50, we've got you covered! It's absolutely possible to start a career in tech at 40+. And here to prove it are several people who've done it themselves.
It's never too late to learn a programming language. Some job seekers who are older may initially doubt their ability to learn coding because of a lack of experience or fear of employment bias. But, the reality is that learning a new skill takes time and dedication, no matter your age.
A senior software engineer often has both bachelor's and master's degrees in fields like computer science. This position commonly requires around six years of experience, but some organizations can require upwards of 10 years for their senior software engineers.
How Long Does It Take To Go From a Junior to a Senior Software Engineer? This can depend on your role, your company, and your own drive. However, an engineer is typically considered to be senior or to be ready for a senior position after five years of professional work experience.
Average Amazon.com Senior System Engineer yearly pay in the United States is approximately $157,736, which is 30% above the national average. Salary information comes from 199 data points collected directly from employees, users, and past and present job advertisem*nts on Indeed in the past 36 months.
On the surface, SDE2 is in a mid-level, non-senior Software Development Engineer role. Some SDE2s are indeed only 2-3 years after graduation. Significant many have 15+ years of industry experience. SDE2 is a very broad level with approximately half of Amazon engineers falling into it.
Introduction: My name is Chrissy Homenick, I am a tender, funny, determined, tender, glorious, fancy, enthusiastic person who loves writing and wants to share my knowledge and understanding with you.
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